Yishai Silber February 10 at 4:12pm
Wow, you've really been privileged to see some spectacular animals out in the wild.
Just a shame you killed them all...
Just a shame you killed them all...
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Eric Welsh February 10 at 6:46pm
I didnt kill all of them....there are a few left. lol
Yishai Silber February 10 at 6:52pm
I just don't get it.
I looked at your profile, you seem like a nice guy. But then what drives you, what brings on the urge to end the life of a creature in front of you?
Maybe it's just something I will never understand. To me, it's like going to an art gallery, walking up to one of the canvasses, saying 'ooh, that's nice', and then putting your foot through it.
I looked at your profile, you seem like a nice guy. But then what drives you, what brings on the urge to end the life of a creature in front of you?
Maybe it's just something I will never understand. To me, it's like going to an art gallery, walking up to one of the canvasses, saying 'ooh, that's nice', and then putting your foot through it.
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Eric Welsh February 10 at 7:39pm
I understand your view, If you get a chance, take a wildlife biology class. You will learn that without predation, herd numbers will grow too much and disease will spread and the whole herd will die off. In alot of areas in the world, all the natural predators have been killed off.(mostly for the safety of humans and their livestock). Hunters are actually the true conservationist. Hunters contribute $2.7 billion a year toward conservation. How much $ did you contribute last year?..... or even the last 10 years?
I choose not put hormone infested meat in the bodies of my family. If you only knew what was in the beef that you get at the store or eat at a restaurant.........Im just trying to give you some facts.
I choose not put hormone infested meat in the bodies of my family. If you only knew what was in the beef that you get at the store or eat at a restaurant.........Im just trying to give you some facts.
Yishai Silber February 10 at 7:55pm
I actually did take a wildlife course, I qualified in South Africa, and I'm pretty clued up on eco-hunting.
It's not true though, that the animals would over-breed and over-feed. At least in Africa, I know a lot of the stock are bred specifically for hunting purposes. I am actually quite close to a number of these breeders in South Africa.
I completely disagree with your statement though, that 'hunters are the true conservationists'
Although the money gained from the hunting industry is put to conservation-related activities, don't try and tell me that most of the hunters out there are out shooting animals because they feel the altruistic need to 'save nature.' That is just not true. Was it in your profile, under interests "Just Killing Things"
Is that the message we want to leave?
I personally prefer my message, where I go to schools and teach children why we must fight, and sacrafice in order to save our wildlife.
The biggest contributing factor to the income of the African Hunting Industry, is their monopoly on that industry, and their prices. Look at the difference in price between a 7 day hunting safari, and a 7 day photographic safari. Obviously hunting brings in more money
Trust me, if all hunting contingencies were to supplement a hunting safari with a photographic one, the annual turnover would not have changed drastically.
If you are hunting for the pot, that is a whole different story. As a meat-eater myself, I one day hope to be able to track, hunt, kill, clean and cook my own meat, at least once.
But what is your logic to shooting bears then? Or lions and leopards for that matter, even though I never saw any pics....
It's not true though, that the animals would over-breed and over-feed. At least in Africa, I know a lot of the stock are bred specifically for hunting purposes. I am actually quite close to a number of these breeders in South Africa.
I completely disagree with your statement though, that 'hunters are the true conservationists'
Although the money gained from the hunting industry is put to conservation-related activities, don't try and tell me that most of the hunters out there are out shooting animals because they feel the altruistic need to 'save nature.' That is just not true. Was it in your profile, under interests "Just Killing Things"
Is that the message we want to leave?
I personally prefer my message, where I go to schools and teach children why we must fight, and sacrafice in order to save our wildlife.
The biggest contributing factor to the income of the African Hunting Industry, is their monopoly on that industry, and their prices. Look at the difference in price between a 7 day hunting safari, and a 7 day photographic safari. Obviously hunting brings in more money
Trust me, if all hunting contingencies were to supplement a hunting safari with a photographic one, the annual turnover would not have changed drastically.
If you are hunting for the pot, that is a whole different story. As a meat-eater myself, I one day hope to be able to track, hunt, kill, clean and cook my own meat, at least once.
But what is your logic to shooting bears then? Or lions and leopards for that matter, even though I never saw any pics....
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Eric Welsh February 10 at 8:17pm
I shoots bears every year...and eat every piece of meat from them. We hunt cougers here too....and eat them. Africa is a story in itself. Come to the U.S. and see what an over populated white tailed deer herd looks like. Every state in the U.S. has a Fish and Game Department with biologist that moniter the animals year round to determine how many there are and what there numbers should be. There is not just an open season to kill animals....there are laws and quota's.
It is great that you took ONE class and are certified in Africa, but you are still uneducated on the statistics or the benifits that hunters bring to the animals.
Are you aware that the U.S. is currently overpopulated with wild boar? These wild boar have put a number of bird species on the "endangered list". Which would you prefer...hunting the wild boar to reduce their numbers of just let them keep destroying the eco-system. Some states in the U.S. have Elk herds that are growing out of control....this in turn forces the Mule Deer to migate to other area's that they are not acclimated to and they end up dying off. What should we do now? Just let the Mule Deer die off? I dont think telling kids "we must fight, and sacrafice in order to save our wildlife." will save these animals. Do you? I do love all wildlife, but I think about these issues with my brain and not just my heart. Anti-hunters are spreading an ill-informed message that doesnt have any facts backing it up. Remember....hunters are not poachers! Poachers are illegal hunters and they dont represent the majority.
It is great that you took ONE class and are certified in Africa, but you are still uneducated on the statistics or the benifits that hunters bring to the animals.
Are you aware that the U.S. is currently overpopulated with wild boar? These wild boar have put a number of bird species on the "endangered list". Which would you prefer...hunting the wild boar to reduce their numbers of just let them keep destroying the eco-system. Some states in the U.S. have Elk herds that are growing out of control....this in turn forces the Mule Deer to migate to other area's that they are not acclimated to and they end up dying off. What should we do now? Just let the Mule Deer die off? I dont think telling kids "we must fight, and sacrafice in order to save our wildlife." will save these animals. Do you? I do love all wildlife, but I think about these issues with my brain and not just my heart. Anti-hunters are spreading an ill-informed message that doesnt have any facts backing it up. Remember....hunters are not poachers! Poachers are illegal hunters and they dont represent the majority.
Yishai Silber February 10 at 8:46pm
Eric, I know, and that is why I am messaging you. The problem with this world is that there is not enough dialogue. First off, it was a 6 month 'class', so yeah, I think for the Level One that I qualified at, it was sufficient...
I honestly never knew those statistics about wild herds in the US, and will certainly look further into it, to educate myself. I don't believe myself to be uneducated or disillusioned, I do believe that most hunters look to the thrill of the kill, to the manly assertion of one's self over a wild beast, before they look to the conservative side of hunting.
And I see this partly by people's responses to other people's hunting pics. It is insensative, and completely disregarding of the act of death.
If you are actually eating the bear/cougar/deer, and not just killing it 'because it is there...' I feel a little better.
So, you are telling me that America's wild bear population is honestly doing OK enough to be hunted every year? I don't like hunting. I don't like the thought that somebody sees the same magnificent creature as I do in nature, but is moved to kill it instead of observe it. But those are emotions talking.
If, as you say, you only hunt those animals that can be sustainably hunted, and you use those animal's parts, I guess it's not ALL bad.
I personally would not be able to shoot a leopard, because I would'nt eat it. But I wouldd shoot and skin a kudu, so how can I tell someone who eats bears that they are wrong.
So your family is fed on only hunted meat?! I like that idea. If they're already eating a carcass, it's good for them to know it isn't born on a shelf in a supermarket :)
When I say "fight", I mean to fight for a cause. To fight the legislation, to fight the corruption, and fight the misbeliefs and non-truths.
When I say sacrafice, I mean sacraficing what luxuries we DON'T need, in order to build a stronger environment. This, I believe, is as important as demarcating protected areas for wildlife. If the children, the next generation, don't care, or don't even KNOW to care, then we are losing the battle.
Eric, don't get me wrong, I'm not attacking you here, I can see your passion for the wild, and that is why I wnated to have this dialogue, to mmaybe learn something new and broaden my horizons
I honestly never knew those statistics about wild herds in the US, and will certainly look further into it, to educate myself. I don't believe myself to be uneducated or disillusioned, I do believe that most hunters look to the thrill of the kill, to the manly assertion of one's self over a wild beast, before they look to the conservative side of hunting.
And I see this partly by people's responses to other people's hunting pics. It is insensative, and completely disregarding of the act of death.
If you are actually eating the bear/cougar/deer, and not just killing it 'because it is there...' I feel a little better.
So, you are telling me that America's wild bear population is honestly doing OK enough to be hunted every year? I don't like hunting. I don't like the thought that somebody sees the same magnificent creature as I do in nature, but is moved to kill it instead of observe it. But those are emotions talking.
If, as you say, you only hunt those animals that can be sustainably hunted, and you use those animal's parts, I guess it's not ALL bad.
I personally would not be able to shoot a leopard, because I would'nt eat it. But I wouldd shoot and skin a kudu, so how can I tell someone who eats bears that they are wrong.
So your family is fed on only hunted meat?! I like that idea. If they're already eating a carcass, it's good for them to know it isn't born on a shelf in a supermarket :)
When I say "fight", I mean to fight for a cause. To fight the legislation, to fight the corruption, and fight the misbeliefs and non-truths.
When I say sacrafice, I mean sacraficing what luxuries we DON'T need, in order to build a stronger environment. This, I believe, is as important as demarcating protected areas for wildlife. If the children, the next generation, don't care, or don't even KNOW to care, then we are losing the battle.
Eric, don't get me wrong, I'm not attacking you here, I can see your passion for the wild, and that is why I wnated to have this dialogue, to mmaybe learn something new and broaden my horizons
I gotta say, that is one of the most OPEN dialogues from both sides I have ever witnessed between a passionate anti-hunter and a passionate hunter. Nice job stating facts to back our cause...and nice job from his stand point being receptive to your offerings. In the end, it might be enough to have some folks at least UNDERSTAND our motivation, even if they dont agree.
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